Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Dilwale Dulhania Le Jayenge/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Graham Beards via FACBot (talk) 17:05, 3 September 2015 [1].

Dilwale Dulhania Le Jayenge

Nominator(s): BollyJeff | talk 03:37, 4 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about a film that has been running in a theater in India for nearly 20 years, making it by far the longest running film ever in the country. It helped propel to stardom an actor who is now arguably the biggest movie star in the world. I have put a lot of work into this article in hopes to get it promoted to FA, and possibly make TFA on its 20 year anniversary. I look forward to your feedback. BollyJeff | talk 03:37, 4 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from FrB.TG

Lead
  • "also known as DDLJ" → "abbreviated as DDLJ" or "also known by its acronym DDLJ".
  • "Kajol Devgan (known mononymously as Kajol)" – redundant. Write simply as Kajol (better be on her biography).
It was that way before, but I was told by another editor in a peer review to add this, for readers not familiar with Indian cinema. BollyJeff | talk 14:55, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Whoever be that "another editor", I think he has not understood Wiki fully. If Madonna Ciccone, Adele Adkins and Beyoncé Knowles don't have to be referred to by their full names in most articles, then even Kajol doesn't. Kailash29792 (talk) 15:18, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Okay fine. BollyJeff | talk 19:47, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • An alt text might be added for the poster.
  • "Earning ₹1.06 billion (US$17 million) in India and ₹160 million (US$2.5 million) overseas" – was the dollars exchange the same when it earned 1 billion?
  • Not sure "one of the biggest hits" is encyclopædic.
Origin and scripting process
  • "Aditya Chopra assisted his father, the director/producer Yash Chopra" – slash should be omitted per WP:SLASH.
  • Somewhere you call him Aditya while there are places where he is called by his surname. Be consistent.
  • Again, "Yash Chopra", "Yash".
The reason for this is that there are 4 people named 'Chopra', and 5 or 6 named 'Khan' mentioned in this article, many times in the same paragraph. I did as best as I could without mentioning their full name each time, which would seem excessive. BollyJeff | talk 14:55, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I know that, and what I am trying to say is that mention their full names the first time. After that, you can refer to him simply as Yash. -- FrankBoy CHITCHAT 16:01, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know if that is appropriate either, because people are usually referred to by there surnames when they appear multiple times in articles. I would like to wait and see what a couple other reviewers say before I change to all first names. BollyJeff | talk 19:47, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Casting
  • "causing Chopra to continue pursuing Shah Rukh.[17][a] Chopra and Shah Rukh Khan had four meetings over several weeks" – "Shah Rukh" or "Shah Rukh Khan" write one and stick to it.
  • "She and Shah Rukh Khan had previously worked together in Baazigar (1993) and Karan Arjun (1995)" – perhaps a "successful" word be added. You can use this source.
  • "Although Chopra was assigned Sameer Sharma as the assistant director" – error.
Sorry, what is the error? BollyJeff | talk 14:55, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
"Chopra was assigned Sammer Sharma". -- FrankBoy CHITCHAT 16:01, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Accolades
  • The table needs to meet MOS:ACCESS for row and col scopes.
Done. I patterned it after the FLC List of accolades received by American Hustle. BollyJeff | talk 19:47, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know so much about the FAC process so that's all I have to say. -- FrankBoy CHITCHAT 11:54, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I believe that I have fixed everything except the names now, thank you. BollyJeff | talk 21:20, 5 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, I have now used first names only after the first mention for all the Chopras and Khans in the Production section. I think it's okay elsewhere as there is minimal repetition. BollyJeff | talk 12:35, 13 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Dwaipayan

  • This sentence in plot "Although both value their Indian origins, they have experienced different parenting styles" sounds editorial. The plot remains same even if you delete this sentence. And, having seen the film, I doubt whether Raj was as dedicated to "Indian" values as Simran.
  • I think the next sentence in the plot can be slightly modified like "Simran was raised by her strict and conservative father, Baldev Singh (Amrish Puri), while Raj's father (Anupam Kher) was very liberal in his upbringing."; or , just liberal (minus the "in his upbringing" part).
  • "One evening, Raj enters Baldev's shop after closing time and feigns a headache to persuade Baldev to sell him beer. Baldev refuses and Raj grabs a case of beer, throws the money on the counter and runs away. Baldev, infuriated, calls Raj a disgrace to India." This episode is taking unnecessarily large chunk in the plot, given it's non-importance in the overall story of the film. You can easily remove this episode.
  • "Baldev accepts Raj, but insults him and tells him to leave after he discovers a photograph of Raj and Simran together in Europe" Is that what happens? Baldev discovers a photograph? I have not seen DDLJ in the last few years so cannot really remember.----Dwaipayan (talk) 20:42, 11 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Yes it is. I shortened as you suggested, but also clarified the reason for the beer scene. BollyJeff | talk 22:56, 11 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Punjab in plot should link to Punjab, India.
  • " Baldev lets her go to see the world before her marriage, but tells her not to betray his trust" Trust regarding what? IMO it is difficult to grasp for non-Indian readers if you are meaning in general trustworthiness; or are you meaning that she should not break his trust that she would marry Kuljit? (I do not remember the film exactly). May be replaced by "reluctantly agrees".
  • " The next morning, Simran is reunited with Raj in the fields" comes abruptly and somewhat peculiar : "in the fields"? Consider replacing with more generic words such as, Raj arrives in India and meets Simran. (otherwise you will have to give unneeded details like Simran wakes up to the tune of a music that Raj used to play, runs towards the source of music, and finds Raj etc).----Dwaipayan (talk) 15:28, 12 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Done. BollyJeff | talk 20:22, 12 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Retrohead

  • Soundtrack: a few c/e suggestions here: can you drop "that were" from the opening sentence and can you clarify who consists the duo (third sentence; I assume it would be Jatin Lalit and Anand Bakshi, but it doesn't hurt to ask).
I corrected it to show that Jatin Lalit is a duo. I could hyphenate their name if I knew which dash style to use. Do you know?
It reads fine now.
  • Box office: I don't know what's the criteria for a film to be called a Bollywood hit, but I suggest using a more neutral word. The rest of the sections seems fine,
Done.
  • I'm not sure if the accolades fall under "Release"; it seems closer to "Legacy" in my opinion, and I often see tables and non-prose sections at the very end of the article. I'll leave the decision to you, since this is not an urgent issue.
I think it should be under Release since many of those awards happened the same or following year. Legacy is things happening years later. BollyJeff | talk 17:14, 22 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "People return not just to see the film, but to be a part of an experience." I'm little concern about the second clause. What do you mean by "experience"? This sounds like some person or critic's opinion rather than a fact, and might unintentionally take a side (favoring the film's projection as a cult experience).
It was in the source, but I guess I understand your concern, so I removed it.
  • I'm not sure about film credits, but I know that albums usually cite the source right after the sub-section title.
Done.
  • Well, you have my support on the prose. I can't provide full support because I'm not very knowledgeable in movies (thus I can't comment on criteria such as comprehensiveness or being well-researched), but good luck with the rest of the comments.--Retrohead (talk) 16:59, 24 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Tim riley

Support. The prose in this article is, I think, the best of any I have seen in an article on Indian cinema. There is no excess of detail, the facts appear comprehensive and are set out logically and with due regard to balance. I think this article meets the FA criteria. A few tiny quibbles:

  • Links
    • There are a couple of duplicate links: non-resident Indians and Jatin Lalit.
    • The MoS bids us avoid links to well-known geographical locations: this includes London.
  • Box office
    • "it has been showing for more than 19 years" – we need to avoid WP:DATED here, just as it has been successfully avoided in the lead, by saying "as of 2105". If the run continues past October this year I imagine we can take it for granted that the nominator will change 19 to 20.
  • Impact
    • re-issued – it may be a matter of WP:ENGVAR, but the OED doesn't hyphenate this word.

That's all from me. The article is focused, readable and well-sourced: a fine piece of work, in my view. – Tim riley talk 10:09, 30 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much for the kind words. I have fixed your issues. BollyJeff | talk 12:45, 30 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Ssven2

Support. Continue the good work, Bollyjeff, Looking forward to Mary Poppins next. — Ssven2 Speak 2 me 06:35, 31 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Cassianto

Support Sorry I'm late, I've had a lot on. You've had some great reviews which has left me with very little so it's just the one comment from me:

  • "Aditya Chopra assisted his father, the director and producer Yash Chopra, during the making of Chandni (1989), Lamhe (1991) and Darr (1993). During this time, he wrote several of his own scripts..." Who wrote the scripts, Aditya or Yash?

This looks to be all in order and makes for an interesting read. CassiantoTalk 19:58, 3 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Coord notes

Image and source reviews? Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 07:10, 8 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Has been requested on project talk page. BollyJeff | talk 11:50, 8 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Image review

I see no problems with these.

SuperMarioMan ( talk ) 13:17, 15 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Source review and spot check

Coming. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:35, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • All authors, pages, isbns, formatted consistently.

Using this version as a reference point for the numbering of the footnotes:

  • Ref 18, used once. Article faithful to source.
  • Ref 34, used twice. Article faithful to source.
  • Ref 42, used thrice. Article faithful to source.
  • Ref 49, used once. Article faithful to source.
  • Ref 120, used once. Article faithful to source.
  • Earwig's looks ok (I think it is the size of the article throwing up some high scores)
Text from 3 of the top 4 scores (Salon and Roger Ebert) is quoted and attributed to the authors. BollyJeff | talk 14:17, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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