Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Food and drink

This is a collection of discussions on the deletion of articles related to Food and drink. It is one of many deletion lists coordinated by WikiProject Deletion sorting. Anyone can help maintain the list on this page.

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Food and drink

Toni Fiore

Toni Fiore (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Fiore claims to be a “celebrity chef” but I’m unable to find articles on her besides actual recipes, book reviews, and blurbs. There may be more articles on her behind paywalls. Putting her up for discussion in case she is more well-known in the vegan/vegetarian world. LovelyLillith (talk) 19:16, 3 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

List of cocktails named after New York City boroughs

List of cocktails named after New York City boroughs (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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New York trivia. I don't think coverage by Secret NYC is sufficient to establish the notability of the topic or WP:LISTN. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 15:18, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Food and drink and New York. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 15:18, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 16:05, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Weak delete - While I love New York trivia, unfortunately this topic may not be encyclopedic per WP:CROSSCAT. The list is already pretty short, as there are only five cocktails named after New York City's boroughs, four of which already have their own articles. The fifth borough, Staten Island, is without a cocktail that bears its name directly, according to the article itself. I should note that, per WP:NOPAGE, I'd be inclined to keep this list if the cocktails didn't have their own articles, since at least two of the cocktails clearly pass GNG; this is why I'm only !voting "weak delete". The Staten Island Ferry cocktail isn't notable on its own, but I assume it's listed here because of WP:NOPAGE. – Epicgenius (talk) 16:40, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Comment There are also apparently neighborhood-named drinks, see [1][2]. SPECIFICO talk 18:46, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

List of duo and trio cocktails

List of duo and trio cocktails (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Notability questioned since 2019. Sources consist mostly of personal sites & blogs. Just Another Cringy Username (talk) 18:43, 31 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Smoked salmon cheesecake

Smoked salmon cheesecake (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Lack of notability - this article mentions a cake that combines two flavors, and notes barely more than its existence. This would make an alright redirect/section on Cheesecake, but it is not necessary to have a separate article. Cf. discussion on Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Pineapple_cheesecake. RudolfSchreier (talk) 15:33, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Food and drink-related deletion discussions. RudolfSchreier (talk) 15:33, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Keep. The nominator proposes deletion, but puts forward a rationale that is essentially calling for merge and redirect. It was brought out in the previous AFD that several iconic cookery books have covered this dish, and that it appears in several books of prize-winning recipes, so it is a prize-winning dish. SpinningSpark 16:41, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    I apologize - I was unaware that the desired outcome of "merge and redirect" was not to be achieved through the AFD process. As you point out, I would be happy to keep the content, simply not the article - which I don't see moving past stub status. RudolfSchreier (talk) 17:14, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    "Merge and redirect" is a valid outcome at AFD, but if that is the desired outcome of the nominator, it is rarely a good idea to bring it here. It is usually far less confrontational to propose a merge at the article talk (for which there are standard templates). This ensures the regular editors at the proposed target are involved in the decision too – the group most likely to be cheesecake knowledgeable. Once you are here, you are in court with an adverserial mentality. I am still deciding whether I would actually support a merge. I want to see if I can find some of the sources mentioned in the previous AFD first to see how much this might be capable of expansion. SpinningSpark 20:55, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Comment - is there a notability criteria for recipes? In the absense of anything else, there appear to be many online and offline sources which give recipes. Isn't that enough? JMWt (talk) 17:31, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    I could not find any criteria at all, I'm afraid. I looked into the deletion of "Pineapple cheesecake" and extrapolated from there:
    Would I want to see separate pages for strawberry cheesecake, raspberry cheesecake, etc.? No, if simply for the fact that those pages would have very little to contribute that the Cheesecake article wouldn't cover.
    Could this be a section on the Cheesecake article? Yes, like Chicago-style cheesecake and New York cheesecake are right now. RudolfSchreier (talk) 17:49, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That's not how we usually determine notability. A bunch of published books including a recipe would appear to satisfy the GNG as far as I can tell. JMWt (talk) 18:31, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If that is policy, then keeping the article would be consistent with it. To me personally, it paints an unfortunate picture of what Wikipedia could look like given enough bored editors. RudolfSchreier (talk) 18:41, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Pineapple cheesecake is not a good comparision here. As was said in the AFD, pineapples are just one of may fruits that can be used in cheesecake. Smoked salmon is something radically different. SpinningSpark 21:00, 18 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Linguist111 (talk) 05:58, 26 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Delete I think we need more than a how-to book for this (a recipe book is basically instructions), some sort of critical discussion in RS. This is about all I found [3] and it's a passing mention. If this was a car, we wouldn't use a Hayes manual on how to fix it for a reliable source, we'd need a discussion about the car. Same idea here. I don't see any sources discussing the cheesecake. Oaktree b (talk) 13:03, 26 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting to see if there is further support for a Merge or Redirect of this article.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 06:01, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Merge to the cheesecake article seems ok Oaktree b (talk) 15:05, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yardley Inn

Yardley Inn (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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I do not believe this organization has received significant coverage from independent sources. I found some websites that make a trivial mention about some of the history. EvilxFish (talk) 07:23, 17 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Food and drink, Business, and Pennsylvania. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 10:43, 17 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Delete. Way too trivial. NYC Guru (talk) 02:43, 20 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • There seems to be some coverage of it, for example Bucks County Magazine, Burlington County Times, The Philadelphia Inquirer (2, 3, 4, 5, 6), Messenger-Press, Philadelphia Daily News, Bucks Happening. Looks like a GNG pass but I'm not too familiar with the business notability guidelines so won't be !voting. BeanieFan11 (talk) 18:26, 20 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Extraordinary Writ (talk) 07:26, 24 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Delete. As said above, this is way too trivial. I'm amazed that it has been on Wikipedia since 2009. Athel cb (talk) 09:15, 24 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

    • We don't determine notability on whether a user thinks the article is of little value/importance (trivial definition), but rather, on whether an article has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. Are you saying that the above sources (some of which - 1 2 are full pages long in major newspapers) do not meet this standard? BeanieFan11 (talk) 22:37, 25 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      Agree with the first point, but as for the notability being established by those sources, I am unsure whether this is the case because of the rather vague nature of what constitutes "significant coverage". Whereas it is well known in the area I work in what we would consider significant coverage or not, I am not sure if the newspaper articles qualify as such here. I will leave it up to people who know better to decide but if I found those newspapers when I first searched for sources, I don't think I would have created this! EvilxFish (talk) 07:16, 26 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Draftify - unclear notability, though there are numerous RSs as seen above. I would be keen to see if the article could be fleshed out, but the current information seems somewhat generic and/or unsourced. ɱ (talk) 22:18, 25 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • I could probably write a sourced version in 1-3 days, although it probably wouldn't be super long and detailed, since I have no experience in this topic area. BeanieFan11 (talk) 22:33, 25 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Keep The Inquirer piece looks the best, the rest also help GNG. The Zagat article shows notability and critical notice of the place. Oaktree b (talk) 00:21, 28 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 78.26 (spin me / revolutions) 04:18, 2 February 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Whole stuffed camel

Whole stuffed camel (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Whole stuffed camel does not sound worthy of being included on Wikipedia. This is more of an urban legend/hoax so it should be deleted as Wikipedia is not an urban legends site. Even if it is not a hoax, it would not be notable enough. 747pilot (talk) 03:35, 14 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Comment Regarding if this is a hoax, I found one book that quotes Guinness World Records as naming it the largest item on a menu in the world, but my searching of the easy-to-search Guinness database found no such record.
My searches of news and books could only find very low credability sources talking about this without irony, and even then they were mostly talking about it jokingly.
I searched images of this, but the results looked doctored.
Conversely, I did find a published academic paper identifying this as folklore "In their collection of urban folklore titled Never Try to Teach a Pig to Sing: Still More Urban Folklore from the Paperwork Empire, Alan Dundes and Carl R. Pagter identify “Elephant Stew,” “Stuffed Camel,” and “Best Ever Rum Cake” as examples of joke recipes that recur in multiple recipe collections" (source: Dutch, Jennifer Rachel. “Not Just for Laughs: Parody Recipes in Four Community Cookbooks.” Western Folklore 77, no. 3/4 (2018): 249–76. https://www.jstor.org/stable/26864126.)
So I think this is a hoax. CT55555(talk) 03:50, 14 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Food and drink and Middle East. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 10:38, 14 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • A whole stuffed camel? That's one of the most absurd dishes I've ever heard of! BeanieFan11 (talk) 18:43, 20 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • On a more serious note, whether its a joke or not, I was able to find some coverage of a "stuffed camel" recipe: Food Cultures of the World Encyclopedia; How To Cook A Camel and 101 Delicious Recipies; Stuffed camel may be pushing it a bit too far on recipes from The Vincennes Sun-Commercial; Stuffed camel can get you over the company hump from the News-Press; Stuffed Animals: A Modern Guide to Taxidermy; Gastro Obscura; Andrew Zimmern's Field Guide to Exceptionally Weird, Wild, and Wonderful Foods; Department of State News Letter; Books in Brief from the Honolulu Star-Bulletin; Michelangelo of the Kitchen from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette; How to roast a camel and other culinary trips from The Hanford Sentinel, plus others. It does look like a GNG pass in my opinion. BeanieFan11 (talk) 18:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 03:49, 21 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Comment with no offence intended to 747pilot it is appropriate for Wikipedia to document notable urban myths and hoaxes, identified as such, of course. I'm currently a very weak keep on the grounds that it does seem to have been referred to quite a bit. But with no strong feelings either way. The test is this: could a reader come across it, and wonder what the background is? Can we help them? I think the answers are just about 'yes'. Elemimele (talk) 11:11, 21 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Keep - the sources exist and it appears that the WP page reflects the story rather than being the origin of it. It might need work to reflect more clearly the multiple sources which say it is a legend/myth. JMWt (talk) 11:21, 21 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The problem is that it appears to be real from the article. Those who are uninformed may really think it's real. Wikipedia should be a source of information, not misinformation so I think deleting it will be best. 747pilot (talk) 20:23, 21 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
It is not the job of WP to police what is or is not a hoax. We reflect what is written by others, we don't have a role in producing original research. Even if this is a longstanding hoax, the fact is that plenty of sources have repeated it. Providing that the uncertainty about the facts is properly and prominently stated, it is perfectly normal to have pages on topics which other people think are hoaxes. JMWt (talk) 07:37, 23 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ❯❯❯ Raydann(Talk) 10:12, 29 January 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

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