Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hotel Barcelona Princess

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge to List of hotels in Spain#Barcelona. MBisanz ^talk 23:54, 18 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hotel Barcelona Princess

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Try also Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL; Fodor's for example lists it as "Barcelona Princess Hotel".

Fails WP:GEOFEAT. I can't find enough reliable, third-party sources to indicate that this structure has any sort of notability. Is being number 10 on List of tallest buildings in Barcelona enough? clpo13_(talk) 17:55, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Architecture-related deletion discussions. clpo13_(talk) 17:56, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Spain-related deletion discussions. clpo13_(talk) 17:56, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Nothing resembling a claim of significance as a business (and hotels are primarily businesses), and its only putative assertion of notability is that it's in a not-unusually-tall building. Non nontrivial reliable sourcing -- just a directory entry. I've stayed in taller hotels that don't have articles here. I've worked in taller buildings that don't have articles here. I've got friends who live in taller apartment buildings in Manhattan that don't have articles here. A business shouldn't be able to evade notability standards merely because it's in a building that doesn't really have more than the tiniest whiff of notability about it. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo). Treated like dirt by administrators since 2006. (talk) 18:21, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Working in a taller building in Manhattan is not so remarkable, but this hotel is in Barcelona not Manhattan. I am sure the 10th tallest Manhattan building has an article, doesn't it? Is that 70 Pine Street; I never heard of it. And let's see if there is notability by wp:GNG. --do ncr am 20:52, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy keep - User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz inserted delete-tags [1] only to several articles created by one user, which is in conflict. In Category:Skyscrapers between 100 and 149 meters there are 1,013 articles and most of this articles have the same arguments to leave. Behavior by User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz is clearly trolling, again. Subtropical-man talk
(en-2) 18:25, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I can't find any non-trivial RS coverage. — Rwxrwxrwx (talk) 18:42, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Merge, probably to List of hotels in Spain#Barcelona, if more notability is not established (or to List of hotels in Barcelona, if that is created as a list-article; watch for Draft:List of hotels in Barcelona). Hey, it is nicer and better to keep edit history in a redirect than it is to outright delete an article. The hotel could become notable for future events, or its existing notability may be established by more sources, and there's no need to completely eradicate the contribution. This hotel can be mentioned in the "List of hotels in Spain" list, with more text than is present for other entries there so far. That list is not yet well developed. The mention should use the Emporis reference in the current article, and should include the fact of it being the 10th tallest building in Barcelona. In fact this hotel, from its pic and size, looks like it must be one of the largest and/or "best" hotels in Barcelona, and probably is notable at least as a list-item.

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hotel Kandahar was an AFD which closed "Merge", for merger of material to new List of hotels in Andorra that was created during the AFD. The new list included just hotels in Andorra that were in historic registry buildings or that were significant for other reasons. We don't need an exhaustive list of hotels in Andorra or in Barcelona, but a list of the most significant ones is reasonable. --do ncr am 21:47, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

(The following was moved from top of page, where I had inserted it, to here, by editor Subtropical-man)

Perhaps this AFD can consider notability of hotels in Spain a bit more generally? Recently there were speedy-delete nominations on:

I am hoping for some centralized discussion of the general issues, but this AFD has proceeded already, and I don't want to require everyone to look at every one of these. Some general comments would be welcome, but the merits of each one are probably different. --do ncr am 21:30, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Ha ha ha. Subtropical-man talk
(en-2) 22:00, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Huh? I disputed the speedy-deletes, which is probably what Subtropical-man prefers, and asked for discussion here. I don't see what is funny about that. --do ncr am 22:07, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

....aside from the typical trolling by user Hullaballoo Wolfowitz.... Only Barcelona and Spain? Why? Please read core content policies of Wikipedia, including Wikipedia:Neutral point of view. Please see more articles in Category:Skyscrapers between 100 and 149 meters and apply the same criteria to all, to 1,013 articles in category. Ok? Subtropical-man talk
(en-2) 22:53, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know why HW speedied those hotels in Barcelona, but they're in question now by me too, despite me usually being an "inclusionist". Why did someone else question a hotel in Andorra? Because it's not obvious hotels are notable. So you suggest these are notable because they are taller than 100 meters? There's no guideline or policy that I am aware of that buildings taller than 100 meters are deemed notable. If you can point to some discussion right on that topic, please do. We're not going to analyze all buildings in that category right now, but this AFD will be a precedent that can be cited if others are as minimalist as these here. And the last 3 of 6 in the list are shorter than 100 meters, so what is your theory about why these ones are notable? Please also note I am suggesting merging material to a list-article, where readers get more value because comparisons are possible. If there is very little info in each article why would you oppose having it all covered in one article? --do ncr am 23:39, 23 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - This topic has received significant coverage from reliable sources including La Vanguardia[2][3]. The tallness of a hotel or building is not a basis of determining notability. (I dare someone here to AfD the 5-storey Hôtel Ritz Paris for that reason).--Oakshade (talk) 05:36, 24 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
~~Comment~~Delete: The miceindustrynews.com link posted above by Oakshade is an advertisement: "The Barcelona Princess Hotel also offers six fantastic meeting rooms with perfect warmth and soundproofing" Vrac (talk) 12:41, 24 April 2016 (UTC) Changed to delete, provided sources are not sufficient to pass GNG. Vrac (talk) 15:28, 1 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Will accept that, but the La Vanguardia coverage isn't an advert. --Oakshade (talk) 16:45, 24 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

No, but it's more about Desigual than the hotel itself. I'm not against keeping the article if some decent sources can be found but what I've seen so far is quite thin. It needs more to pass WP:GNG. The Catalan wiki article is no help. Vrac (talk) 18:23, 24 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it's actually heavily about the design of the hotel and Desigual's roll in that. That's significant coverage of this hotel.--Oakshade (talk) 20:24, 24 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

So, @Vrac: and @Oakshade:, please add informations + these sources to article. Subtropical-man talk
(en-2) 18:41, 24 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

WP:NOTABILITY and WP:AFD are clear that the existence of sources is what counts to notability, not that they're already in the article. --Oakshade (talk) 20:24, 24 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I'm not certain about notability, but I removed the speedies on the other hotels, because obviously they need discussion. I think it unlikely that additional sources could not be found in, for example, Catalan newspapers. I know in NYC the construction of significant hotels is always discussed in the NYT and elsewhere, DGG ( talk ) 09:14, 25 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as nothing yet convincing of solid improvements. SwisterTwister talk 06:43, 28 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Onel5969 ^{TT me} 13:32, 1 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Business-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:42, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Companies-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:42, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz ^talk 01:01, 9 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Merge to List of hotels in Spain § Barcelona. Does not appear to have received enough coverage to qualify for a standalone article at this time. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 20:15, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.